Good sailcloth for JR

  • 08 Feb 2017 21:50
    Reply # 4599010 on 1206989
    Deleted user

    Hi there, I have some lovely photos from David Harding of Amiina's new sail. 

    Just have to work out how to put them on the website.   They will show the tell tales in action. 

    Also the material is very satisfactory for my use.  I don't intend to cross oceans, maybe the Channel, but not much more. I have had her out in some quite strong winds, with no signs of any wear or stress. We have also acheived what we wanted with the panels inflating easily in the lightest of airs. 

    2.2 ozs. ripstop spinnaker nylon seems to be very appropriate for this size of sail, and the sort of sailing 90% of us do. IMHO. 

    Last modified: 09 Feb 2017 09:25 | Deleted user
  • 08 Feb 2017 21:23
    Reply # 4598838 on 1206989
    Don't forget that most nylon cloths are very susceptible to UV, so a sail made from one will require a cover - if UV is an issue in your sailing area.  I made Fantail's last wind vane cover from spinnaker nylon - it's still there, but I reckon a sharp poke with a finger would easily make a hole in it!  (Don't try, Bryan!) 
  • 08 Feb 2017 20:16
    Reply # 4598666 on 1206989

    Hi David,

    I would agree on using a non-stretchy polyester to cover a wind vane as you will want it to stay tight, but the very slightly stretchy nylon should be softer for a low stressed cambered sail, and set better. I was always slightly jealous of Arne's blue nylon sails, and after making the plywood feel polyester sails for Poppy have always been looking for a good nylon to use. I'm wondering if I've found it in Amiina's new sail, being tough and light. We'll see.

    Cheers, Slieve.


  • 08 Feb 2017 19:54
    Reply # 4598595 on 1206989

    I've got some 92 gm/sq m/2.7 oz sq yd textured ripstop polyester from Pennine Outdoor, which I intend to use for the cover of my new wind vane. I must say that I would find it more convincing than the 70 gm/sq m/2 oz/sq yd silicone coated ripstop nylon from the same source, as a lightweight sailmaking material.

  • 08 Feb 2017 17:50
    Reply # 4598256 on 1206989

    I ordered a sample of the balloon cloth. We'll see what it feels like in real life :)

  • 08 Feb 2017 15:52
    Reply # 4597994 on 1206989

    For Amiina's new sail I got a sample of the 2.2 oz nylon ripstop spinnaker material as I was concerned that the silicone finish would not stick to the basting tape. There proved to be no problem and as the material had a nice soft finish I went ahead and used it. I understand the ripstop threads are the equivalent to the normal threads in 6 oz plain material so I was not surprised to find it to be very tough and would not tear. When working with the fabric the skin on my hands felt very soft and smooth, so the silicone did have an effect, but it was very easy to work with, and I would be happy to use it again. Only time will tell how long it will last, but I see no reason not to use it on much larger sails than the 175 rig for Amiina.

    It was much nicer to work with than the 200gsm/ 6 oz Terylene/ Dacron I've used in the past. 

    The hot air balloon material looks interesting, and should be worth taking a closer look.

    Cheers, Slieve.

    Last modified: 08 Feb 2017 16:04 | Anonymous member
  • 08 Feb 2017 08:42
    Reply # 4597282 on 1206989

    Jami, as someone coming new to JR, and coming new to sailmaking, I do feel that you should stay with a material that someone else has already tried for sailmaking, successfully. I can understand why the racers such as Edward and Ketil are using ultralight sails, but if you're not racing, you need a sail that is both easy to make, and easy to live with. This silnylon is not easy to sew, and will not be easy to live with.

    I try only to recommend a cloth that either I have used successfully myself, or I have heard of someone else using successfully. My experience has been that the softer uncoated cloths work better for JR, and are much easier to work with. In my case, Clipper Canvas. In the case of Sebastien Hentschel, a professional sailmaker, Weathermax. The Outguard material that you have found seems to be very similar to Weathermax in its characteristics, so it's not stepping too far outside of my comfort zone to say that it's worth a try. Outguard 190 is the right weight for your sail size - not too light, not too heavy.

    But there's no harm at all in getting a metre or two of any material you find, getting hands-on and doing some sewing trials. This will eliminate some of them, straightaway.

    One that you might want to try, if you want to be a pioneer, is http://www.extremtextil.de/catalog/
    Cordura-330den-uncoated-185g-sqm::181.html
     - soft and easy to sew, and Cordura lasts well when used for outdoor gear.

    Last modified: 08 Feb 2017 09:04 | Anonymous member
  • 08 Feb 2017 08:20
    Reply # 4597262 on 1206989

    Arne and David,

    I have the utmost respect for your views and experience on this, and I'm most grateful for your help. However, a JR-newbie like me seems to get lost very easily when the opinions are so far from each other.

    I would like the price and the colour selection of the balloon cloth (which would make it possible to make a rainbow sail!). But I don't like the thought of a short-lived sail and even less the thought of a ripping sail in a hard weather.

    What if I chose the light balloon cloth, and used it as it is in the lower panels, but as a double in the upper three or four?

  • 07 Feb 2017 23:15
    Reply # 4596730 on 1206989
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Maybe it makes sense to ask the balloon cloth maker about the life expectancy. I doubt if balloon makers would use a material which lasts for less than 5 years.

    Besides, I suggested using a sail cover between use.

    Arne

    PS: From the last article about Edward Hooper's Amiina, in PBO (Mars issue) I see that the new (16.25sqm) sail is 2.2oz ripstop spinnaker nylon. 2.2oz is less than 100g/sqm, isn't it?

    Last modified: 07 Feb 2017 23:23 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 07 Feb 2017 20:37
    Reply # 4596477 on 4596458
    Arne Kverneland wrote:

    Yes, yes, yes,

    that balloon stuff looks great, and at a decent price. I would go for it. It may be an idea to (later, when the sail and lazyjacks have found their place), to make a decent sail cover (UV and damp protection), similar to the one I have fitted, first to Broremann and now to Ingeborg.

    Arne

    No, no, no! 

    This is material for ultralight backpacking tents. I know, because I have just bought something similar to make a tarp for the mountains this summer. I would use it for a small dinghy, up to 3.5m. I would not use it for anything larger.

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