Turn it over to the professionals?

  • 08 Jun 2018 23:24
    Reply # 6299957 on 6295550

    Hah, hah, David.  You know you don't mean it!

    I think, Gary, that what David is doing is taking the dregs of his glue to fill the screw holes: no doubt with microfibres and, worse, colloidal silica as part of the mix, instead of mixing up a batch of filler.  I have some different approaches to both leftover glue and filling screw holes.  Use leftover glue to start filling the the Vs in stringers, etc.  Fill the screw holes with wooden plugs instead of glue paste. You put them in with glue, so this uses up the dregs of glue which we thrifty people don't like wasting.

    Of course, you need a box of plugs cut in advance, which don't actually have to be made out of the same wood as the plywood - scraps from your framing material will do.  You have to drill the holes out with the appropriate drill, but that needn't take long.  And with wood plugs, you don't have to go back and 'top up'  the filler if it sags.  I'm not sure that it isn't as quick as filling if you have everything set up for it.  A lot easier to sand, too.  A multi-tool docks the plugs very effectively.

    If I do use glue for filler, I try to get at it with a scraper before it gets rock hard, but sometimes it's a job done at the end of the day, or in David's case, before he goes back to work.  Then it's hard yakka.

    Not quite on topic, but on the other hand, any tips to make the job go easier puts off the evil hour of perhaps having to employ someone.
    Last modified: 08 Jun 2018 23:26 | Anonymous member
  • 08 Jun 2018 07:17
    Reply # 6295550 on 6295534
    David Thatcher wrote:

    So, having spent half the day sanding and finishing off all twelve bulkheads for my new catamaran here is my Boat Building Tip of the Day;

    DON'T DO IT - Buy a ready built boat!

    Tip #2, and Memo to myself:

    Don't be lazy and use left over glue mix to fill screw holes. It is too hard to sand off, use proper filler mix.



    Add microballons to the mix and it will be easier to sand.:)



  • 08 Jun 2018 06:52
    Reply # 6295534 on 6290195
    Deleted user

    So, having spent half the day sanding and finishing off all twelve bulkheads for my new catamaran here is my Boat Building Tip of the Day;

    DON'T DO IT - Buy a ready built boat!

    Tip #2, and Memo to myself:

    Don't be lazy and use left over glue mix to fill screw holes. It is too hard to sand off, use proper filler mix.


    Last modified: 08 Jun 2018 07:12 | Deleted user
  • 08 Jun 2018 02:47
    Reply # 6295375 on 6290195
    Anonymous

    Win-win! We would all love to see you :-)

    Shemaya

  • 07 Jun 2018 21:17
    Reply # 6294432 on 6290195
    Deleted user

    That's a good point, Shemaya.  It would probably pay for the extra shipping.  Plus, then I'd have an excuse to get up Down East more often.

  • 07 Jun 2018 19:59
    Reply # 6294072 on 6290195
    Anonymous

    Hi Scott,

    The difference between Mystic and Newport, and Maine, is likely to be a vast difference in cost. It's extraordinary how much the costs of everything to do with boats drop as you get into Maine. I had a 20 foot boat built in Narragansett Bay – not to art standards – and the amount of cash that went into that was truly shocking. Might be something to consider, as you think about locations for help…

    Wishing you all the best with your project!

    Shemaya

  • 07 Jun 2018 16:40
    Reply # 6293230 on 6290195
    Deleted user

    Such a great range of thoughtful and experienced replies.  Thank you all.

    Tackling Arne's question first - this boat will be a blue water cruiser I intend to take me anywhere an intrepid adventurer might want to go, from Scotland to New Zealand.  It'll be my home for hopefully more than a few years.  I think that there are perhaps some systems / goodies with which I could do without for a while, but as it's my home, I'll need it in pretty good shape before I splash.

    I too, David, wonder if my skillset and large-project drive aren't more a curse than a blessing.  I've built some decent sized projects, including a single-handed, simple machines only, 36 x 24 barn / workshop in which I was going to build a 28 foot cruiser based on the Graham Byrnes designed Princess Sharpie.  (See, "alimony" above.) I tend to get itchy if I'm not working on something extensive.  But full time cruising could be that extensive thing instead of mostly full time building.  I think.  

    Peter's advice to only do those jobs that are fun, and set a time limit, is great.  I was already planning on farming out the exterior fairing and painting - "soul destroying" is an apt description.  I don't feel that much else is beyond my skillset except finish carpentry.  I have no doubt that I'd make more scrap than art, and worse, my small mistakes will glare at me for years.  (I tend not to see the slightly mismatched wood or gaps in other people's work, though.  You know how it is.) Arne's point about focusing great quality on items with which we have a tactile and frequent relationship is right in line with my thinking;  I don't skimp on doorknobs, light dimmer switches, or hand planes.  But I don't need perfect finish in behind the locker doors. 

    I will say that when I was tearing up the interior, each part that came out was met with the thought,  "Man, that's another 40 hours of careful fitting and finish work to put a comparable thing back in."  

    When my kids were young and I had to stay around the house, I loved large projects.  But my kids are heading off into lives of their own soon, and I'd like to spend much more of my life energy on, um, grownup relationships, shall we say.  (See, "alimony" above.)  And that's hard to do if I'm, like Mark, working on the boat every night and eight or so hours during the weekend.  What's bothering me is the opportunity cost; life is short.

    Zane, I actually consulted with James Baldwin early on in the project - he's quite knowledgeable and has a great philosophy.  I may contact him for this.  Alternatively, I've already reached out to Tim Lackey in Maine, and we'll see what he says.  But I've got to think that with Mystic, Connecticut and Newport, Rhode Island so close, there'd be a good collaborative shop nearby.  Trouble is, the good ones are often a bit off the water and get trade through word of mouth.  I'm going to the Wooden Boat Show in a few weeks at Mystic Seaport Museum.  Perhaps I can get a few locals talking and make some recommendations.

    Last modified: 07 Jun 2018 16:51 | Deleted user
  • 07 Jun 2018 10:54
    Reply # 6292117 on 6290195
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Scott,

    I think you should tell us how you are going to use the boat when you get it operational. If  your main plan is to cross big oceans and be away for years, then obviously you have to finish the interior before launching.

    Another big factor to decide on is how high standard you need to be happy with the result. A high standard of finish is very time-consuming and expensive.

    (On fishing boats in my country, I have noticed that things that were touched regularly, were fitted to a nicer finish than the rest: Tiller, steering wheel, wheelhouse door etc. always looked good.)

    On the other hand, if you would be happy to do some coastwise cruising, first daysailing, then weekending and then longer trips maybe, and learn to know the boat and the new rig, then there is another method:

    ·         Get the structural bits like bulkheads and stringers properly fitted.

    ·         Fit the through-hull fittings, hatches and windows.

    ·         Get the engine operational.

    ·         Make some temporary interior, the cabin sole and a couple of berths/benches, to let you camp inside. A little paint here and there and some carpets could make the cabin  look less like a coalmine or abandoned shack.

    ·         Get the rig operational.

    ·         Splash!

    This will let you get under sail much more quickly (if that is what you want). Then, break down the proper fitting of a permanent interior into small projects, and avoid having more than 2-3 projects running at a time (..it can be good to have more than one project running, so you can work in one place while the glue or paint is setting on another, or while you are waiting for some stuff to arrive...).

    The ratio between income and available time decides how much help you will hire.

    Good luck!
    Arne


    Last modified: 07 Jun 2018 10:57 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 07 Jun 2018 07:55
    Reply # 6292001 on 6290195
    Deleted user

    From a professional point of view, We have a number of projects that are ongoing and we have worked with a number of people refitting and building their boats.

    There are certain jobs that are massive, boring and repetitive. These are the jobs that wear people down and take away the spark. 

    Always tackle jobs you feel happy doing and are within your skill set yourself. but have a time limit on them.

    If a job is going over the set time get in help

    If it over your skill set get in help, watch and learn

    We have a couple of great guys here but we always get in help for

    sanding and cutting back, hull prep ready for painting. These two jobs are not difficult but can be soul destroying and take silly amounts of time.

    If you have spare money coming in then use it. even if its to buy something you don't need straight away. Always keep momentum in your work.

    One thing I have always said, as a rule, home built boats have a higher quality than commercial builds, however, don't get bogged down with time-consuming work. 

    People who look at your boat will not see the little detail but will take in the overall appearance.

    Get the job to a useable standard you can always go back and replace locker doors etc in a refit 3 years down the line but you will have had 3 years pleasure.


  • 06 Jun 2018 21:20
    Reply # 6291274 on 6290195
    Deleted user

    This is a difficult one, and a question of some philosophical significance. So,some of my experience. I have often been told I am lucky to have the skills I have, but sometimes I feel I am cursed with these skills. I struggle with the concept of paying someone else to do some thing I am able to do myself. I have built from scratch, and with no power,two complete houses. Not tiny houses but full size 1000 sq ft houses. I did this because it was the only way I thought I could afford to get the houses I wanted, and I had also been inspired by the Craftsman Built house books of the seventies, so there was some romanticism tied up in this. And lastly I had the skills to build the houses. Together those two houses took up ten years of my holidays and spare time during my late twenties and most of my thirties. I have also built a complete interior into my third home which was an old church, and finished off our current home from an empty but lined shell.

    Now I am in my sixties I have been wondering whether I made the right choices, and especially with the two complete houses I built I could have been off having fun, and travelling. And I suspect those house builds were a big contributor to the failure of my first marriage. But looking back there is also a sense of achievement, and I am grateful for the skills I have learned whilst undertaking these building projects. I have also built boats. But have I achieved the right fun to work balance in my life? I don't know.

    The last few years I have decided that no more big building projects for me because I just want to relax and enjoy life, and my hands are not what they used to be. But in that decision there was a sense of loss. I have allowed my tools to deteriorate, and I have felt aimless because of the lack of a creative project. So, at age 65 I have just started building another boat. But I hope I have made an intelligent choice in what I am building. It is a six meter sailing catamaran, very light weight, but with comfortable, for the size, accommodation, and hopefully an easily achievable build, but the project is also balanced by the fact I have a boat I can sail on while doing the build, and I have other things going on, including working 4 ten hour days in a job I enjoy, but that leaves me 3 days free each week. Now I have started the build I feel quite invigorated,and I think I can enjoy the project just for the creative aspect, but I am trying not to think about all the epoxy and sanding!

    The other thing to keep in mind when undertaking these big projects is 'one step at a time'. If one tries to think of all that needs to be done for the entire project you will very quickly become overwhelmed. 

    Last modified: 06 Jun 2018 21:40 | Deleted user
       " ...there is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in junk-rigged boats" 
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