Graham, I don't feel any contradiction here! I was trying to say, earlier, that in a "yachtsman's gale", Force 6 - 8, heaving to can be a useful technique. I think we agree, though, that it's the sea state that matters, not the wind strength. A 50 knot squall in flat water can be tough sailing, but not dangerous. 30 knots of wind that is opposed by a current, putting up big steep seas, can be very dangerous.

The only time that I was knocked down in Tystie, in the South Atlantic, the wind was less than gale force, but had changed direction rapidly, and I suspect that there were some ocean currents involved as well, so that the seas became steep and confused. In such conditions, there is not one straightforward answer. Have a look at this recent account of a very similar encounter with confused seas, again with no easy answer:

http://figure8voyage.com/disaster/

In such cases, heaving to certainly isn't the answer, and in my case a drogue wouldn't have helped.

Raymond,

Please try to put heaving to, fore-reaching and lying ahull on one side, as a technique for surviving extreme weather. For such working craft as pilot boats and fishing boats, they were a useful technique for staying in one place in all weathers, and so they evolved hull types that did that well: very heavy, with full length deep keels. But, that kind of boat does not make a good cruising yacht. Cruising yachts from the last 50 years or so, that are fit for long distance cruising, are moderate in all respects - chiefly in beam, draught and displacement - and their best way of surviving extreme weather is to turn their stern to it, and to run under bare poles, using a drag device to keep their speed within safe limits. There is now a consensus amongst experienced offshore sailors that using the Jordan Series Drogue is the preferred option in survival conditions.

Hello Raymond,

I see from your profile that you are an old dinghy sailor, so from that I am assuming that you have little or no offshore sailing experience. I think that you may be thinking of the landsman's "storm", meaning " a lot of wind (undefined)", whereas a seaman defines a storm as being the next step after severe gale in the Beaufort Scale.

Repeating what I said earlier: Let's be clear what both of these techniques [fore-reaching and heaving to] are for: they make it possible to stop the boat, to wait for any reason, to think about what to do next, to cook, eat, navigate and do maintenance, in greater comfort when the sea is rough, (in up to Force 8, and possibly force 9 if the sea state is not too bad). But not, with modern boat types, as a way of surviving very heavy weather (Force 10 and above), just as a way of achieving a bit of comfort in moderately heavy weather.

I suggest that you get a copy of Heavy Weather Sailing, By Adlard Coles, updated by Peter Bruce. This will bring you to an understanding of what it is like to be at sea in a gale, or more than a gale. If you look at the photo on pp 54-55, taken in the North Atlantic in Beaufort F10 - 11, Storm - Violent Storm, you will see, I hope, that survival has nothing to do with the rig, or with heaving to. 

But don't worry! Very, very few sailors experience the ultimate survival storm at sea. I haven't, after sailing the length and breadth of the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans.  

Nicholas Head wrote:

What a facinating thread this has turned into for those of us with.limited heavy weather junk experience. Thank you all.
Am I right to assume that the fore reaching method is needed to provide the flow over the servo blade to keep the helm set the right way. I imagine that going too much sideways would not be beneficial to using the windvane?

And quite apart from anything else, if you have a servo pendulum gear, engaging the wind vane is an excellent way of lashing the helm, including having a bit of "give"!