Badger with aileron forward of the keel

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  • 04 Dec 2021 21:20
    Reply # 12166255 on 12150362

    You can contact any member of the JRA simply by going to the membership list and clicking on their name.  There is a way of doing it via the JRA and generally people include their email address.

  • 03 Dec 2021 02:59
    Reply # 12161614 on 12150362

    And thanks everyone for all of the comments - they are greatly appreciated.

  • 03 Dec 2021 02:58
    Reply # 12161611 on 12150362

    A riding sail and setting two anchors both seem like logical solutions if the problem is in fact the boat wandering all over at anchor.  And Annie's comment seems to confirm that this can be an issue. The builder's comments were in French, not a language I speak, so he and I were communicating with the assistance of google translate, an imperfect partner for these purposes - I'm still not clear if he was trying to reduce wandering at anchor or if the goal was improving windward performance.   So I'll put those ideas on my list.  For now the metal fitting on the hull can just stay there with a bit of new paint to stop corrosion.  As soon as I figure out how to contact the skipper of Zebedee I definitely will - the choice between flat and cambered sails is going to hit me as soon as I can stop sanding and painting the bottom.  Oh well, that is going to take a while - 3 coats of 2 part epoxy primer were recommended by a boatyard that bid pretty much the price of the boat to do that work so I'll be looking for the right DIY yard to spend some quality time underneath the new boat.

  • 02 Dec 2021 21:31
    Reply # 12160982 on 12150362
    Badger certainly moved around a lot at anchor.  However, I think this had everything to do with having no forefoot to speak of and a big mast and sail in the eyes of the boat, and nothing at all to do with the keel.  I suggest you ensure that you have a good double roller and set the foredeck up so that your can deploy two anchors easily.  We used to do this quite often on Badger, in windy conditions, and with the two anchors well apart it made a big difference.  It was easy to set a second anchor by setting a panel of foresail, pushing the helm over to starboard and letting out extra cable on the main anchor (the second anchor set on the port side of the bow).  When we had gone far enough, we'd drop the second anchor (and sail) and then pull back on the main cable until No 2 had plenty of scope.

    Alan has Arne-style sails on Zebedee and had no experience of sail making when he built his first suit.  He's in quarantine at the moment, so probably has plenty of time  on his hands if you want to discuss them with him!

  • 01 Dec 2021 16:40
    Reply # 12158254 on 12150397
    Anonymous wrote:

    Well to my surprise I got an immediate reply from the builder, who says the boat was too active especially at anchor, and he added the airleron to stabilize the boat. He said he felt that he had to do that or move the keel forward.  I suppose I could build one of plywood/epoxy/fiberglass, but I am still interested in comments from others especially those who have sailed Badgers.

    I've been wondering what "too active" means in the context of adding a so called "airleron" to the keel....  Usually one would think "too active" meant "sailing at anchor".  It seems irrational to add a horizontal surface to stop this.  It makes me ask weather "too active" meant rolling excessively at anchor??  "Sailing at anchor" would seem to be a problem of the center of anchored windage as related to the center of lateral resistance.... I'm not sure why one would use a  horizontal surface to tame this.  The logical solution it would seem to me would be to add windage aft in the form of a riding sail.....or anchor from the stern as a few people have done to prevent this.   I simple socket like David Omick uses on Minimus II .... illustrated in his blog, a free standing light weight mast, and a small sprit sail at the transom......

  • 29 Nov 2021 15:48
    Reply # 12153931 on 12150362
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Paul,
    If I were to make new sails for a Badger type Benford 34, I would contact Alan B Martienssen first. He has loads of (long distance sailing) experience with his Zebedee, both with flat and cambered panel sails.
    I bet he has some useful info for you.

    Arne

    Last modified: 29 Nov 2021 15:50 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 28 Nov 2021 22:29
    Reply # 12152508 on 12150362

    I made the latest suit of sails for Badger herself, and I've been able to find a drawing of the cloth layout I used for the parallelogram panels. Since the chord of both sails is 12ft, it was a no-brainer to put four vertical 3ft wide cloths side by side (that being the normal width of regular polyester sailcloth) and to put broadseam into the forward two seams. Unfortunately, I can't find a dimensioned sailplan, but that can be taken from VOASI, I think.

    1 file
  • 28 Nov 2021 20:11
    Reply # 12152317 on 12150362

    You are quite correct about the old flat sails - apparently with lots of sailtape and worse holding them together at the moment.  So, I will have to learn how to sew!  Do you or others have sail designs worked out for a Badger, or do I need to start by studying your book "how to Make a Junk Sail."  The sewing and rigging chapters I have read already - and I rushed through Ch. 4 which will obviously need a more careful study.

  • 28 Nov 2021 08:50
    Reply # 12151601 on 12150362
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Paul,
    My Alo 28, Johanna initially had quite some lee helm with her Bermudan rig. Even though I moved the CE aft when converting to JR, there was still some of it left afterwards. The fore section were quite circular, giving little or no grip or ‘bite’. Then I fitted the “fore skeg” you see on the photos. It is just 2 x 15mm plywood, which I simply epoxied right onto the hull, using neither screws nor glass-fibre. 

    This tamed her somehow, and the little lee helm that was left (only fully close-hauled and in light winds) was no problem to live with. Johanna was known to be exceptionally easy to steer.

    If you buy that Badger, I suggest you try her first without any fin on it and then decide. That boat most probably has flat old junksails. There would be more to gain from making a new set of sails with cambered panels.

    Cheers,
    Arne


  • 27 Nov 2021 14:51
    Reply # 12150397 on 12150362

    Well to my surprise I got an immediate reply from the builder, who says the boat was too active especially at anchor, and he added the airleron to stabilize the boat. He said he felt that he had to do that or move the keel forward.  I suppose I could build one of plywood/epoxy/fiberglass, but I am still interested in comments from others especially those who have sailed Badgers.

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