Sheet to tiller self steering, windvanes, and autopilots

  • 18 Aug 2014 07:49
    Reply # 3076414 on 1493031
    Deleted user



    A reader on ybw thought this about the article:


    The new copy of PBO landed on the doormat and as I work nights I knew that not much would get done today, then. I was fascinated, as I always am, by the article about a cruise to the Faeroes using a Hebridean windvane. I spent quite some time with a magnifying glass, figuring out how the device worked but I found the text not only unhelpful in this respect but downright misleading. The author claims that the horizontal vane and associated power ratio is a unique feature of the Hebridean design. Well that is obviously b###s and probably means that the author, despite having built the unit doesn't fully understand how it works. Checking with the guarded remarks on the designer's website it all becomes clear - and quite ingenious it is too.

    In many ways there is nothing unusual about the basic design and linkage arrangement until you look into the angles that both the turret mount and servo blade form with the vertical. If these were in fact vertical, the assembly would demonstrate why feedback is required to avoid simply snaking along a course with even deviations either side of that desired. The setting of the air vane pivot on an angled lever means that as the whole assembly rotates with the pendulum movement, the angle of the vane's pivot axis aligns with the wind direction as the pendulum reaches its maximum design travel, the servo blade's rudder therefore straightening out at maximum swing. All very ingenious and delightfully simple, but in the conventional sense the linkage is reversed to achieve this relationship, so the tiller lines have to cross to achieve the correct sense of output (tiller input).

    I wonder whether PBO's editorial staff did any work on the text - It isn't unusual for a piece of text to fail to communicate the message, so an editor may often tweak the language and maybe the author failed to realise the new meaning it gave? I can well understand that the designer, having designed and prototyped the Hebridean, which is offered as a kit of metal parts (just add the wood), and offering it at a very reasonable price, he would not wish to give the plans away too. I hope my comments don't offend, but the claim made is plain wrong - most windvanes nowadays are horizontal axis servo pendulums and share the power ratios of the type. It's the feedback mechanism that differs in this design.

    Last modified: 18 Aug 2014 07:50 | Deleted user
  • 18 Aug 2014 03:10
    Reply # 3076341 on 1493031
    Sounds like I'm going to have to keep an eye out for this copy of PBO!
  • 17 Aug 2014 08:58
    Reply # 3076027 on 3076026
    Anonymous member (Administrator)
    Peter Scandling wrote:

    I have just discovered this wind vane site  For £300 it looks interesting as a kit.  I believe it's been or about to be reviewed in PBO and Yachting Monthly.  Perhaps any UK members who read these publications could keep an eye out.

    Cheers

    Peter


    The Hebridean windvane is described in the September PBO, the same as  has the Bermudan vs junk rigs story.

    Arne

  • 17 Aug 2014 08:21
    Reply # 3076026 on 1493031

    I have just discovered this wind vane site  For £300 it looks interesting as a kit.  I believe it's been or about to be reviewed in PBO and Yachting Monthly.  Perhaps any UK members who read these publications could keep an eye out.

    Cheers

    Peter

  • 13 Mar 2014 21:47
    Reply # 1517269 on 1493031
    The video link was interesting, more so the 'foolish muse' site, which has a downloadable pdf on singlehanded sailing.  This is a must for all junkies - he has really sorted out how to sail a BM rig, spinnaker and all - still sounds bloody awful, long live the JR!!  Bit on sheet to tiller steering v good though, also some other interesting chapters.
    Last modified: 13 Mar 2014 21:49 | Anonymous member
  • 11 Mar 2014 22:50
    Reply # 1515748 on 1493031
    Here is a video of a Bermudan rigged boat demonstrating sail controlled self steering, which may be of interest even though not junk rigged.  It was flagged up on Dylan Winter's "Keep Turning Left" blog, which is well worth following.
  • 24 Feb 2014 13:15
    Reply # 1504551 on 1493031
    I had a look at how a tillerpilot is set up with a Hydrovane, and what I have in mind is similar. I've just bought yet another tiller pilot (3 now) this one is a Raymarine Evolution 100 which I think should work very well for controlling a servo rudder. The actuator is separate from the control head and heading sensor, so there should be no problem mounting the actuator longitudinally to reduce clutter at the stern. It could possibly be mounted vertically as well. Also I won't have to climb back there to alter course. I'm not sure if the Simrad would be happy mounted longitudinally, it has an internal heading sensor and it might get confused. My guess is that the Simrad will do that in standalone mode, but if connected to a chartplotter in nav mode, I don't know what it would do.

    A quote from the Hydrovane site: 

    “Second only to the importance of keeping the boat afloat is the importance of having steerage.”

    I second that.

    Last modified: 24 Feb 2014 13:28 | Anonymous member
  • 23 Feb 2014 22:39
    Reply # 1504257 on 1499538
    Deleted user
    Robert Leask wrote:

    I also have a Monitor and a Simrad tillerpilot and I've heard very good things about combining the two, and that's in my plans as well. You can't have too many ways of steering. The only things that are off my list are human steering, or training a dog to steer. That would be cruelty to animals.
    Hi Robert. I know you didn't mention Hydrovane but their site has some examples of driving one of their devices with a tiller pilot.
  • 23 Feb 2014 00:04
    Reply # 1503871 on 1499538
    Robert Leask wrote:The track on top of the tiller is an excellent idea, but how did they attach the control line?
    The track had a slide on it which was located by moveable stoppers on either side.  The slide had a large eye or loop welded to it.  My friend passed the staysail sheet through the loop and around the tiller a couple of times then half hitched the sheet back onto the standing part.
  • 17 Feb 2014 11:52
    Reply # 1499538 on 1493031
    The track on top of the tiller is an excellent idea, but how did they attach the control line? The system I used worked the first time I tried it, but my first mistake was tying it to the tiller with a clove hitch. When I tried taking it off it was jammed so hard it was as if it was welded, that was a long time ago and I don't recall if it came untied at all. I may have had to cut it. What worked was an over/under/over/under wrap around with a hitch around the standing part, that never jammed. At the other end I used a rolling hitch with a couple of half hitches a few inches apart on the sheet line. That never jammed, or slipped.

    I also have a Monitor and a Simrad tillerpilot and I've heard very good things about combining the two, and that's in my plans as well. You can't have too many ways of steering. The only things that are off my list are human steering, or training a dog to steer. That would be cruelty to animals.
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